yellowbelly1945
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An Elephant Hawkmoth from my garden, released alive
Posts: 157
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Post by yellowbelly1945 on May 10, 2010 10:57:50 GMT
And also.. if you've been strongly in favour of PR voting reform over the last 15 years, then why have you been supporting the Tories, who are strongly against it, all that time? Yeah, I know, you support other aspects of their ideology. But still, it's just another thing which confuses me. I belive in an ideology, a Conservative ideology, as expounded by Conservatiove PMs and Conservative philosophers during the last 150 years. I don't like PR systems which give voters a second (or third choice), such as STV and AV (Labour's choice), but do think the Open List system is fair to everyone.
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yellowbelly1945
Empress
An Elephant Hawkmoth from my garden, released alive
Posts: 157
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Post by yellowbelly1945 on May 9, 2010 11:36:21 GMT
I notice that Patrick's Southwark Council, which he thought was excellent, has gone from a LibDem/Con coalition to an overall Labour controlled council. where did you see this? i'm looking at the bbc election site and it says his area is LD hold. www.southwark.gov.uk/news/article/18/elections-6_may_2010 and www.london-se1.co.uk/news/view/4529Florence, I'll give you my view of the article on Hammersmith Council later. Atm I'm doing very selfish things like tidying up my house ready for renovations - it is a total tip, and also I must get some exercise, so after breakfast, (i've only just got up) I'll be going for a long walk. My initial reaction to the article was that if it is true then it paints a bad picture of that council. I always like to research the other side of articles written by openly anti-Conservative writers, to see, for example in this case, what was the reason behind the closure of the shelters. If they were closed because the Council didn't want homeless people hanging around then it's bad, but it may be that they were closed because better accommodation was being offered, so once I've done my research I'll comment, and I've been too busy to do any research. On PR I have been in favour for more than 15 years. The Dutch system , the Open List system, seems to be the fairest to me. It means multimember constituencies but I don't see that as a drawback. The Closed List system was used in the European elections, where you can only vote for a political party. In the open list system you can vote for individual canidates. So if you are choosing, (say) 5 MPs then you vote for the 5 individuals of your choice. These may all come from the same political party, or may be any combination of up to 5 political parties / independents. (In addition The Dutch tend to use voting machines, which makes the count of votes much easier and more accurate.)
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yellowbelly1945
Empress
An Elephant Hawkmoth from my garden, released alive
Posts: 157
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Post by yellowbelly1945 on May 8, 2010 13:14:41 GMT
I notice that Patrick's Southwark Council, which he thought was excellent, has gone from a LibDem/Con coalition to an overall Labour controlled council.
I will add to the general discusssion on this thread later. I only had 2 hours sleep between 7am Thursday and 11.30pm Friday, but have had a long sleep and only just got up, so there's the usual jobs to do around the house - like wasking up 3 day's pots, etc.
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yellowbelly1945
Empress
An Elephant Hawkmoth from my garden, released alive
Posts: 157
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Post by yellowbelly1945 on May 5, 2010 23:24:48 GMT
The support of the most vulnerable in our land was my motivation for getting involved as a councillor, and is central to Conservative thinking for over 100 years.
Cameron set up a Social Justice Group within the Conservative party to identify the causes of poverty and possible solutions, and this study helped in the formulation of policies, as are on the Conservtive manifesto.
I do not have the time to read a blog from an anti-Tory blogger, and withoput doing research on the content could not comment.
I know what I believe; I know of the long record of the Tories in relieving poverty and helping the most vulnerable.
Everyone should vote for the candidate who is nearest to their beliefs, although hopefully that's not BNP. If you can't find anyone to vote for consider next time standing yourself, and this time show an interest by going to the polling station and spoiling your ballot paper.
I shall be back on Saturday. Goodnight.
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yellowbelly1945
Empress
An Elephant Hawkmoth from my garden, released alive
Posts: 157
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Post by yellowbelly1945 on May 5, 2010 19:52:57 GMT
I've read the reference. A few posts back I did say that I respect your views and I hope you respect mine. I'm not into pointscoring, but was asked to comment oin Philippa Stroud's views in 1989 so countered them with Sir Stuart Bell's of the same year. It seems only the left wing parties are allowed to change their minds, except of course for the former LibDem frontbench spokes guy for Agriculture etc, Tim Farron, who is probably the most homophobic MP in parliament.
I believe in certain principles - the purpose of power is to delegate as much power back to people; while the state should look after the most vulnerable. Of course there's more to my principles.
Despite how Conservatives may or may not have voted in the past re gay rights, the only party which meets my principles is the Conservative Party and they will get my vote.
So, go and vote tomorrow, how you want. Enjoy yourselves in the evening - I'm going to the Verification of Ballot papers at 10pm, and then the Count for the Council seats at 3pm on Friday. I expect I'll be up late Thursday evening, but doubt I'll come on here again until Saturday.
I hope one day to meet you all at one of Patrick's gigs. Be kind and pleasant to all, even us Conservatives.
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yellowbelly1945
Empress
An Elephant Hawkmoth from my garden, released alive
Posts: 157
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Post by yellowbelly1945 on May 5, 2010 17:14:22 GMT
That was in 1989 when Sir Stuart Bell, the Labour MP for Middlesbrough said: "It was not ‘morally right or socially desirable' to give homosexuals the same rights as heterosexuals. Instead, we need 'a broader agenda of moral vision'". And this year Ben Summerskill,. of Stonewall wrote in The Guardian: ""Stonewall's analysis of MPs' votes in the current parliament shows that George Osborne and Francis Maude have better recent voting records on gay equality than one in five Lib Dem MPs. And Kate Hoey, the least gay-friendly of all Labour MPs, has a voting record worse than more than 120 Conservatives." and then there's Tim Farren, the homophobic LibDEm MP for Westmoreland. as for DC and Section 28 he did issue a public apology for voting against its repeal; see www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2009/jul/02/david-cameron-gay-pride-apology
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yellowbelly1945
Empress
An Elephant Hawkmoth from my garden, released alive
Posts: 157
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Post by yellowbelly1945 on May 4, 2010 21:48:43 GMT
That's funny. Who's Josh.
Trouble is I can't answer some of the questions, as I don't drink tea (green or black, only fruit or herb). I don't drink cofee, decaff or caff. I don't have a TV. I have no sense of smell so pheramones have no effect on me, and as a result of not being able to smell I can't taste very well. As for the sandwiches: a) Cheese - like it, but it's fattening. b) Bacon - ditto c) Chicken - only eat chicken twhich I know to be free range and organic, but can't taste much difference between meats so tend not to eat chicken at all d) Nutella - lovely but far too fattening. e) Empty - this isn't a snadwich, but just two pieces of bread f) Other - I tend not to eat sandwiches at home. While out on the streets (delivering local election leaflets) today I ate a crab sandwich and a ham and mustard mayonaisse sandwich.
To the question: 10. Are you a 65 year old ex-conservative councillor? Definitely not. I'm not 65 until 24th June 2010 (and anyone who dares to call me an OAP or Pensioner, or Senior Citizen may arouse my violent side). I'm a forner Conservative councillor.
I can't remember the last time I saw a Disney film.
I'm probably addicted to the Wolfboard.
Favourite book - difficult to answer. The one I've read most is the Diaries of Etty Hillesum - the diaries of a Dutch jew killed at Auschwitz.
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yellowbelly1945
Empress
An Elephant Hawkmoth from my garden, released alive
Posts: 157
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Post by yellowbelly1945 on May 4, 2010 20:31:31 GMT
Yellowbelly, I know Josh said it elsewhere already, but there's no such thing as 'too late'. Thanks for your encouragement, Florence, but I know myself. To be honest I think I'm frightened of forming relationships.
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yellowbelly1945
Empress
An Elephant Hawkmoth from my garden, released alive
Posts: 157
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Post by yellowbelly1945 on May 3, 2010 20:27:12 GMT
I'm gay. I could never have told my parents - they've both been dead over 20 years. My Guardian reading sisters were lukewarm when I came out to them. They couldn't understand why I needed to tell anyone, while for me coming out was like getting a massive weight lifted off my shoulders and my conscience. Sadly I came out far too late in life to form any lasting relationships. If I was desperate for sex I could pay, but I'm not. It's just good having gay friends who I can kiss and cuddle.
Young men turned my head when I was young, and sadly they still do.
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yellowbelly1945
Empress
An Elephant Hawkmoth from my garden, released alive
Posts: 157
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Post by yellowbelly1945 on May 3, 2010 20:13:00 GMT
Um, excuse me yellowbelly, but you're on a Patrick Wolf forum. Half the posters here are gay, and the other half REALLY don't need to be told to "get over it". Anna just meant that sexuality as well as periods, really needed their own threads because both topics were frequently discussed. You can find our sexuality thread here: www.patrickwolf.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=cr&action=display&thread=5548 Have a nice day. Florence. I did do a search and couldn't find it, so don't know what it says. I see the title is Orientation not Homosexuality. I'll have a read. Have a nice day too, tomorrow and for evermore. What we agree on is the highly talented and adorable PW. I hope he will be doing some touring later in the year.
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yellowbelly1945
Empress
An Elephant Hawkmoth from my garden, released alive
Posts: 157
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Post by yellowbelly1945 on May 3, 2010 16:26:44 GMT
guys, periods and homosexuality really deserve their own thread so they can be discussed in great depth Why does homosexuality need its own thread? I'm gay. Get over it. (To quote Stonewall)
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yellowbelly1945
Empress
An Elephant Hawkmoth from my garden, released alive
Posts: 157
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Post by yellowbelly1945 on May 3, 2010 14:47:08 GMT
Yellowbelly hasn't disappeared, but has been busy supporting the Conservative candidate for my area in the local elections - out again tomorrow and Wednesday all day.
Clegg is always going on about blue and red and the need to change to a different colour - one which has been rejected by the electorate because of its policies since the early 1900s, but the change that's needed is in how Central Government operates, from top down to bottom up, and only one party is advocating that, and it's not yellow or red.
I do wonder why Mr Clegg doesn't withdraw the Liberal Democrat whip from Lady Tonge, the well-known anti-semite. It's also noticeable now that Mr. Clegg has only one woman on his front-bench.
I look at policies and the overall political ethos. David Cameron has made it quite clear that the Conservative Party is a One Nation party, for all the people. This will be the 12th General election I will vote in and the 12th time I will vote Conservative. My attitude is that people are old enough to make up their own m,inds who they vote for. I will be very sad if the BNP and UKIP get protest votes from former Labour voters, as has happened in local elctions and in the last European.
I wish you all well. I respect your views, and trust you respect mine, but I won't take part in point scoring.
The state of the National Debt, and the £163 Billion deficit means that there are tough times ahead whoever runs the Government after May 6th
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yellowbelly1945
Empress
An Elephant Hawkmoth from my garden, released alive
Posts: 157
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Post by yellowbelly1945 on Apr 26, 2010 21:58:11 GMT
One could ask why it took Parliament so long to decriminalise homosexuality, considering Russia did so in the 1830s, as did many other countries long before Britain did. Although he later joined the Labour Party, and then the SDP, and then back to Labour the first Bill in Parliament to decriminalise homosexuality came from a Conservative MP.
As for the outgoing MPs they are the outgoing MPs. The new intake will be different. There are 3 openly gay MPs in the Conservative Shadow cabinet, and about 20 extra openly gay Conservative candidates, including one in Leeds.
The point I was making was that the Conservatives have had both a female PM and very likely a gay one, while Labour have had neither. Thatcher wasn't a feminist, but she was a woman.
As for Section 28, it was wrong and Cameron has apologised for it. Incidentally Harriet Harman's uncle, Lord Longfors, the Labour peer, vehemently supported section 28. He was wrong too.
As I've said previously times change and people's views and policies change with time.
I thnk that "broken Britain" sums up quite a bit of what wrong with Britain, such as dysfunctional families (not just Sharon Matthews), an appalling criminal justice system, low levels of literacy - 40% of primary school leavers cannot read and write properly, an emphais in secondary education on raising the percentage of pupils getting 5 A-Cs and caring nothing for those who are not even submitted for exams. And then of course there's the national debt which has gone up by £930,000+ in the 3 minutes it's taken me to type this post
I'm signing off now as I have a job to do which I must do before I go to bed, which I suspect will not be before 5am.
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yellowbelly1945
Empress
An Elephant Hawkmoth from my garden, released alive
Posts: 157
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Post by yellowbelly1945 on Apr 26, 2010 21:24:52 GMT
That Mirror article is pathetic. You just cannot make a sweeping statement about one political party based on a very very small percentage of councillors, all of whome will have had the Party whip withdrawn for making such remarks.
I haven't done research on councillors of other parties or independents; frankly life is too short. My experience of the Conservative Party, and I've been involved in it at national regional and local levels over the years is that the party is no more homophobic than any other, and certainly not sexist. The Conservatibe Party had the first female Prine Minister, and probably had the first gay one (Edward Heath?).
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yellowbelly1945
Empress
An Elephant Hawkmoth from my garden, released alive
Posts: 157
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Post by yellowbelly1945 on Apr 26, 2010 21:17:31 GMT
No it's not going to happen. I've lived alone for far too long to inflict myself on anyone. It wouldn't be fair to them.
Also CM Punk I don't know KC.
This is a Patrick Wolf board. Can I say that despite me being almost 65 that I do find him attractive. I think he's a lovely guy, and exceedingly talented. I hope the love he has for his boyfriend grows daily. I'm hopelessly romantic in that I want to see others have happy loving lives, but I know I never will myself form a loving relationship with anyone.
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yellowbelly1945
Empress
An Elephant Hawkmoth from my garden, released alive
Posts: 157
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Post by yellowbelly1945 on Apr 26, 2010 20:58:27 GMT
A word about the B+B incident. Grayling is a twat. He voted for the legislation. He's apologised, and withdrawn his remarks, but I think his frontbench days are numbered.
It's easy to do one-sided research. Andy Burnham, Keith Vaz, Peter Kilfoyle, and Frank Field, and many other Labour MPs voted against homosexuality equality. Sir Alan Beith and Tim Farron, the LibDem's Shadow Secreatry of State for the Environment, Food, and Rural Affairs also voted against; and Tim Farron is strongly homophobic yet Clegg has appointed him a Shadow Secretary of State.
Many people are floating voters. I'm not. I've been a Conservative since I was 14. Labour's action on homosexual equality was right, but Labour's overall ethos of the State knowing best is something I can't agree with. I've seen them centralise policy decisions, and emasculate local government. They've vastly increased bureaucracy, and once again got the country into a massive debt problem, just as they did the last time they were in power.
I am against the formation of a European Army, the Euro, and an amnesty for illegal immigrants, (all LibDem policies). I was against the Iraq invasion, and belive we should aim to reduce conflict, and strengthen the United Nations rather than Nato.
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yellowbelly1945
Empress
An Elephant Hawkmoth from my garden, released alive
Posts: 157
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Post by yellowbelly1945 on Apr 26, 2010 17:38:12 GMT
I've had crushes but never fallen in love with anyone, and now it's too late. I regret that. I'm sure I could have made someone happy, and received the love of someone. But that's life. I haven't and it won't happen now, as I fear relationships and getting involved.
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yellowbelly1945
Empress
An Elephant Hawkmoth from my garden, released alive
Posts: 157
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Post by yellowbelly1945 on Apr 26, 2010 17:07:39 GMT
I see that Southwark Council, which you love, is a LibDem and Conservative coalition, Labour being the opposition party.
The Conservatives, I'm one of them, are progressive, but everyone is entitled to their own views.
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yellowbelly1945
Empress
An Elephant Hawkmoth from my garden, released alive
Posts: 157
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Post by yellowbelly1945 on Apr 26, 2010 16:02:21 GMT
What are you talking about "vinyl in motion". What "tricky points" are outstanding? You give me them and I'll give you my views. My attitude is that people can vote for who they like. Like Jadeface my family were not wealthy. My dad worked as an electrician for the local Council (pre nationisation) and then the Electricity Board. My mum was a part-time barmaid. We lived on a Council estate.
'll post this and then review what people of written to see if I can find any unanswered "tricky points"? I can't find any unanswered "tricky points". Fortunately the "expenses scandal" got rid of a lot of MPs who should have retired years ago. As Florence says there may be a few left, but they're in the minority. I do know that being involved in Government , whether at National or Local level can become a way of life and many people don't want to give it up, and these of course unclude effective MPs / councillors.
I won my Council seat from Labour, and it's been Conservative ever since. It includes a large former Council estate, which the last Conservative Government spent £22million on renovating. The area still has problems of educational underachievement, although Ofsted has rated one of the local primaries as Outstanding.
I'm still involved in a charity there which supports young people, paying them to go on residential weeks, like outward bound courses, or paying for trips to Alton Towers, or going paintballing.
I'm fairly unconventional. If I was to dwell on the fact, what would really fuck me up would be the fact that I'm 65 in June. The majority of my friends are under 25. I do own my own semi outright. I'm only worth about £180,000 dead, and that includes the house, and the bulk of that is going to young people who didn't get the right start in life.
So give me the "tricky points" and I'll try to answer them, or tell you if I haven't an answer. No political party does right 100% of the time, not even Asquith's Liberal Giernment of 1910.
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yellowbelly1945
Empress
An Elephant Hawkmoth from my garden, released alive
Posts: 157
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Post by yellowbelly1945 on Apr 26, 2010 13:40:03 GMT
CM Punk Raising the tax threshold to £10,000 will not help those who don't earn or recieve £10,000, the poorest in our land, but will give money to people on £99,000 p.a..
I don't like categorising people, but I do believe we all have a responsibility to help alleviate poverty, both in the UK and overseas. Libertarian doesn't mean "Sod the lot of you", it means allowing people to get on with their own lives free of interference from the state and from others, except that people need to pay some taxes to provide essential services and to alleviate poverty, which includes raising educational achievement.
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