For those who've heard it: Rate BACHELOR

[comaman]

I figured to do this, since I'd love to have a look at what you people think of the album. I don't want to start the old discussions about leaking etc. (I personally have listened to it because I'm going to review it - my personal luck, cause I don't go for leaks), but would appreciate to see a ranking of it and why.

Personaly, I'd give it a 7.

I love some tracks, but others feel a bit... well, are not so much my taste. It is still a very strong record, but the production at times sounds a bit 'flat' - Vulture and Damaris are just not my thing at all, and I still have to mae up my mind if I find Bachelor and Battle interrestingly innovative or dull.

So, how would you rate it?

[stentorsrevenge]

I'd give it an 9. The Messenger and Thickets didn't start off strong, but they are really really growing on me.

[helwin tins]

7 maybe 7.5? There's nothing really there that I feel compelled to listen to on repeat like the other three albums, but it's not a bad album. Overproduced, underfunded maybe. If it were by anyone else then I'd give it an 8.5 .

[honestthief]

I see the album as this epic journey so to me, every song is relevant, and the album doesn't sound overproduced, and the incorporation of the female guest vocals like a narration throughout.

Contrary to what alot of people say, i don't think that there are too many ballads, though i think that Who Will does take a little too long to build up. The highlights definitely for me are Hard Times, Oblivion, Damaris, Thickets, Count of Casualty, The Sun is Often Out, Theseus...see i'm naming most of the album and i feel like i'm excluding the others.

Instead of a number, because all of Patrick's work is right up there, I'd say The Bachelor is equally as good as Wind in the Wires (we all love that album to death, right?). bring on The Conqueror!

[sickmouthy]

Much as I respect the right of everyone to have an opinion, comaman and Ceremony's comments re; the production of this record are ludicrous; this is very definitely an awesome sounding record, very, very far from flat or overproduced as I understand those terms. It's one of the best sounding records in terms of pure sonics, mixing, mastering, etc, that I've heard in a long time.

Have a read of this - www.stylusmagazine.com/articles/weekly_article/imperfect-sound-forever.htm

[sickmouthy]

But yeah, much as I don't like assigning a numerical mark to an album, I'd comfortably give this an 8 and maybe even a 9. (For reference I'd mark the others a 6, a 9, and an 8, in chronological order.)

[Debs]

May 8, 2009 13:34:33 GMT sickmouthy said:

Much as I respect the right of everyone to have an opinion, comaman and Ceremony's comments re; the production of this record are ludicrous; this is very definitely an awesome sounding record, very, very far from flat or overproduced as I understand those terms. It's one of the best sounding records in terms of pure sonics, mixing, mastering, etc, that I've heard in a long time.

This sounds fabulous on my earphones, loses something on the Zeppelin (Sickmouthy reckons there's not enough space between speakers on the Zep to do the mixing justice), is good in the car where there's clear definition of where the sound is coming from (left, right etc) and will apparently sound fab if I position audio speakers far enough apart. This may well be something I tinker with this weekend.

As for the album, easily an 8/9. I've yet to skip songs, and today's favourites are Oblivion and Blackdown - there's a bit at around 4:20 seconds that makes me want to leap around, country dancing style. I can't believe I just admitted that.

[Zurich80]

Only heard three tracks as of yet, but 'Damaris' is simply beautiful. Immediately in my top 5 Patrick tracks. Gorgeous strings, haunting woodwind and a wonderful arrangement all round. Flat production? Absolutely No way. This track in particular reminds me very much of Marc Almonds 'eastern ' period, around the 'Stars We Are' and
'Enchanted' albums. In fact, the strings sound like they were actually played by Le Magica themselves!

Lush.

[cmj]

Kriegsspiel - N/A
Hard Times - 5
Oblivion - 6
The Bachelor - 9
Damaris - 6.5
Thickets - 8
Count of Casualty - 8
Who Will? - 7.5
Vulture - 5
Blackdown - 7.5
The Sun Is Often Out - 8
Theseus - 6.5
Battle - 6
The Messenger - 7

Overall; 7/10. So gutted that the production of Damaris takes it down from 8/9 to 6. The production actually takes a lot away from a lot of the songs.

[cmj]

Looking at some of my ratings I've realised how much they change but also how sometimes I overlook some of the solid songs on the album such as Count of Casualty when criticising it - when I receive the album in all its "deluxe" glory then I shall listen again and maybe I will understand it.

[Xteenuh]

I wouldn't say the production is bad but I guess I can see why people wouldn't like it... I think we're just used to the more raw sound on his first two albums, and this one is just so crisp and clear it's like WHAAT? I'll admit it's something I'm kinda having to get used to still, but other than that, I think this album is incredible. Definitely no less than like an 8.5/9 from me. As he always does, it's very well put together and I love how the tracks flow and I ADORE Tilda's narration in it, I think it really gives some of the songs that extra amazingness and makes it more interesting. It's not cheesy, it works to really great effect. I love the whole theme of the album as well and the lyrics are great, and his voice is just sounding better than ever and overall listening to The Bachelor I get the impression that he really put all his heart and soul into this stuff (not like he doesn't usually anyway though, but it seems this one is especially honest for some reason) and that's what really gets me. I think my favorite tracks are Theseus and The Bachelor... and Who Will? just thrills me.

The only slight problem I have is with the track Damaris, it's awesome, but when I hear it, I get this Lord of the Rings montage running through my brain, like Aragorn whippin' out his Sword of Gondor ready for battle and Samwise Gamgee carrying Frodo up Mount Doom and shit, and then I start thinking about Gandalf and Orcs and Hobbits instead of the actual song... I think it's the strings that do that to me.

[hex object]

May 8, 2009 13:34:33 GMT sickmouthy said:

Much as I respect the right of everyone to have an opinion, comaman and Ceremony's comments re; the production of this record are ludicrous; this is very definitely an awesome sounding record, very, very far from flat or overproduced as I understand those terms. It's one of the best sounding records in terms of pure sonics, mixing, mastering, etc, that I've heard in a long time.

I'm going to say that I agree with you on the fact that the production should not be faulted but I do disagree with your comment on the mixing of the album, because it sounds very flat to me. That said, I'm taking into account that I'm listening to a leak and not the "actual" final release so I'm hoping it'll sound better in CD format. The mixing on a lot of the songs almost buries Patrick's vocal, especially on Damaris which is my biggest complaint. And it must be noted that this is the first time (correct me if I'm wrong) that Patrick has recorded his album completely in a studio environment so of course the usual buzz and crackle from his home demos will be missing. I still don't know if that's a good thing or not...

But to get to the main point of this thread I think I'd give this album a 7 or 7.5 if I was feeling generous. It's not as good has his last three, imo but it still has many redeeming qualities. I've found that it's become a picker album where I'll listen to only about 7 songs and skip the rest or I'll get the urge just to listen to one song. Patrick's albums have never been like that for me so it's strange to see that this one would end up being like that. This might be a sequencing problem but I do find that there is more filler on this album than his last three. That being said, the songs I do adore are FANTASTIC and probably better than most of the songs on Lycanthropy and The Magic Position, which leads me to believe that he should have taken the best from The Bachelor and The Conqueror and made them into one 12-14 song album.

[sickmouthy]

What are people who are bemoaning "flat production" listening on, and what bitrate and type are your files?

[Sorrow By Nature]

May 8, 2009 13:34:33 GMT sickmouthy said:

Much as I respect the right of everyone to have an opinion, comaman and Ceremony's comments re; the production of this record are ludicrous; this is very definitely an awesome sounding record, very, very far from flat or overproduced as I understand those terms. It's one of the best sounding records in terms of pure sonics, mixing, mastering, etc, that I've heard in a long time.

Have a read of this - www.stylusmagazine.com/articles/weekly_article/imperfect-sound-forever.htm

You, Sir, should get a "quality poster" award for your contributions to this messageboard so far. ;D Thoroughly enjoyed reading that, and I can't agree more with what you're saying.

I am obviously not going to comment on the production until I've actually heard the CD, but seeing as how TMP was a lot less flat than the first two albums... The problem with TMP, being that parts of it, to me, didn't feel entirely finished and thought through. It simply lacked those little touches, production-wise, that would have made it a lot better.

Vulture and The Tinderbox both sound amazing. Well produced, clean, open and definitely not squashed through too much compression and limiting. But I may understand how fans of home recordings might not like the "new" sound. Technically, I'd hate to judge something at a final level this early on, but I'm pretty sure this will be an album to remember a long time from now, where TMP will fade, more or less.

/t

[cmj]

May 9, 2009 7:03:01 GMT sickmouthy said:

What are people who are bemoaning "flat production" listening on, and what bitrate and type are your files?

VBR, which is what most of my music is in.
Although when I first heard WITW it was only 128kbps so it's definitely not the quality of the music.
I just don't like the production at all, I miss the rawness of his first two albums.

[cmj]

May 9, 2009 8:10:23 GMT Sorrow By Nature said:

Vulture and The Tinderbox both sound amazing. Well produced, clean, open and definitely not squashed through too much compression and limiting. But I may understand how fans of home recordings might not like the "new" sound. Technically, I'd hate to judge something at a final level this early on, but I'm pretty sure this will be an album to remember a long time from now, where TMP will fade, more or less.

/t

I love the sound of the Tinderbox, it's one of the few songs (as well as the Bachelor) where he's got the production just right.

And no way will this be an album to remember. Lycanthropy and WITW yes, but this is less memorable than even TMP.

[stentorsrevenge]

May 9, 2009 12:11:03 GMT cmj said:

but this is less memorable than even TMP.

I really disagree with this. TMP was gigantic at the start but it sort of fizzled, mostly because Patrick wasn't feeling it at the time of its release. The "new" fans love TMP, but fans of the first two albums are much more satisfied with The Bachelor, I think. And this is his stable fanbase.

[Emelie]

I get the impression that a lot of people doesn't like TMP that much, why?

[cmj]

May 9, 2009 15:25:30 GMT @stentorsrevenge said:

May 9, 2009 12:11:03 GMT cmj said:

but this is less memorable than even TMP.

I really disagree with this. TMP was gigantic at the start but it sort of fizzled, mostly because Patrick wasn't feeling it at the time of its release. The "new" fans love TMP, but fans of the first two albums are much more satisfied with The Bachelor, I think. And this is his stable fanbase.

I got the impression that regardless of whether people liked TMP or not, a lot of people aren't too keen on the Bachelor. So neither this nor TMP are going to be albums that will be remembered a long time from now.

[stentorsrevenge]

Perhaps, but a lot of people got into Patrick because of TMP to begin with. Maybe because it was on a bigger label.